18. McKinley Hunt
The last time I was able to chat with members of the Exeter Chiefs ladies' rugby union squad, the side had just taken reigning champions Saracens' unbeaten record. They then won another tough battle at Sandy Park to inflict a first defeat of the season on Harlequins, before winning away at Wasps in one of the most exciting games you could wish to see.
Although the Chiefs winning streak recently ended at the hands of Saracens, who produced an excellent second-half performance to overturn a half-time deficit; there can be little doubt about the remarkable progress and impact that Exeter have made in what is their debut season.
That previous conversation had been with front row forwards Olivia DeMerchant and Emily Tuttosi, and for this latest interview we not only stay in the Chiefs' pack, but also head back across the Atlantic as this article features Canadian international second row McKinley Hunt.
During what I like to call "research" (just to set that professional tone…), I discovered that McKinley's grandfather had played rugby union here in the United Kingdom; at what level had he played, and when did he decide to move to Canada?
"So, my Grandpa's from Edinburgh, so his family is Scottish. He moved to Canada after World War II, so I have a lot of family located over here, which is quite funny. He grew up in Scotland, but actually went to Rugby School in the Midlands, and then did an engineering degree at Cambridge, where he played rugby for the University side. He went on to play for the RAF too, but I don't think he played much representative rugby … maybe some age-grade stuff in Scotland; but the highest level he played was for the RAF.
"I'm not sure what the reason for moving was on my Dad's side; my grandfather had fought in the RAF and I think he was just looking for a new opportunity, and there were so many engineering jobs available in North America around that time; but on my Mom's side, her parents came over because the opportunities just weren't there in Edinburgh at that time."
Given that both sides of McKinley's family both hailed from the Scottish capital and had travelled across the Atlantic to start a new life, had they maybe known each other before emigrating?
"No, so my Grandpa met my Grandma when they moved to Canada. Although her family is Scottish as well, they moved one generation earlier. They didn't even meet where my family is actually from; they met on the west coast of Canada, we currently live much further east, so it was kind of a fluke really!"
A lovely 'fluke' nonetheless. I have always been fascinated by family history and those chance encounters that bring people together and completely change the course of people's lives. I like my geography too, so asked McKinley about her home town, which is King City in Ontario.
"It's actually a very small town, north of Toronto. It's technically in what they call the GTA – the Greater Toronto Area – but it's just a small rural town, lots of farm fields. It's growing in popularity, but it's just a tiny place in a region that's close to lots of bigger towns and cities. I'm only an hour-and-a-half's drive from Toronto, so you can access everything in the city, but…" and McKinley smiled wistfully at this point, "you can also go out for a walk at night and not see anybody, which can be nice!"
It was against that backdrop that McKinley started playing rugby at the age of 14; and three years later she was selected for the Canadian under-20 squad – a massively impressive achievement in anyone's eyes. Given that Canada is such a vast country, how are the best players spotted and given the best chance to reach their potential?
"I think it depends on where you live. We are very good at the sport; we are third in the world and have some really great players, but I wouldn't say that it's one of our sports in terms of popularity. Obviously [ice] hockey would be way up there and even soccer would be up there too; so, a lot of the time it depends on where you live and the teams that you play on.
"For me I was lucky," she continued. "I live in Ontario; it's a much larger province with much more opportunity for rugby as opposed to other provinces. It basically comes down to if you start playing in high school - which is when most people would start – and you enjoy it; then you might go on to play for a club, then maybe university or a provincial representative team. That's usually where you start to get the exposure and be noticed by some of those age-grade coaches.
"It's a lot different now to when I was 15-years old, aspiring to play for Canada, but not really being aware of the pathway. For the youngsters who are starting out now, it's a much clearer route to the top, and the opportunities to build that skill base and show coaches what you can do are now much more accessible than they ever have been."
So was McKinley still at high school (notice how easily I slipped into fluent Canadian) or university when she was chosen for the national under-20 squad.
"It was after my first year at Queen's University [in Kingston, Ontario] when I played for the under-20s, but I was still only 18 when that happened
So presumably the potential for exposure and being noticed is greater once you are in that university environment?
"Exactly. I think it was definitely a combination of being at university but also having played a couple of years of provincial-level rugby by that time. Even during my first year playing for Ontario under-18s, I would occasionally hear that someone might be coming to watch me play, so it was that in conjunction with the university, because coaches will come and watch the national and provincial championships for university sport – they were the two major factors."
McKinley's progress on the field was rewarded with selection to the full international side for the three-test tour to England in 2017 and a senior debut…
"Yes, it was our November series in 2017; we came over here, played England three times, and lost quite badly on all three occasions, but definitely memorable because it was my first time with the full team."
Exeter team mate Olivia DeMerchant was already a fixture in the Canadian squad, and there was also recognition for another club colleague, Emily Tuttosi.
"On that first tour Emily and I were both uncapped – actually, Em might have been capped, I'm not entirely sure – but we were both there on that tour, and Liv [Olivia DeMerchant] was obviously there as well. I spent quite a lot of time with Emily at that point because I had played national under-20s with her in my first year, but I didn't have that much interaction with Olivia … honestly, I was in awe of her," McKinley laughed at the memory, "I was like 'I'm just going to hide in the corner and make sure no one notices me for the wrong reasons!'"
How much time did McKinley get on the field?
"I got game time in all three matches. I think I had about 25 minutes for my first cap and maybe 35 minutes in the second and third; but I came off the bench in all three, which I think was good for my first caps. Looking back, I was definitely not in the mental space to handle the pressure of starting, especially at that point in my career. I was happy to come off the bench!"
Sport can have a nasty habit of placing obstacles in the way, especially when things seem to be going really well; and it wasn't long after those first caps that McKinley sustained a serious ACL [anterior cruciate ligament] injury.
"I had just turned 20 and it was definitely a huge mindset shift," McKinley readily admitted, "something that I wasn't prepared for or expecting, and as you said, it was so tough to come off those first three caps and put in so much work in the off-season to prepare myself for the upcoming season, to then get injured in our first national team camp of 2018.
"Realising that you're going to have to re-evaluate everything you had planned for at least the next 12 months is a hard pill to swallow, but I've come out the other end and I think I'm better for it."
So much emphasis is placed on the psychological aspects of elite sport, being able to produce your best under extreme pressure; but mental toughness can be tested every bit as much, if not more, by the impact of a long-term injury. Was there any support available to McKinley as she went through the process of recovery and rehabilitation?
"I did get some mental support, but nothing formal until just last fall; so, I basically did the whole rehab without any formal assistance. In hindsight it could have helped me get back a bit sooner; but I'm also one of those people who likes to internalise things and not necessarily express them. So, when I got the injury, seeking out assistance was never on my radar – I was just going to put my blinders on, get into the routine of rehab, and try and get to the end of the tunnel."
Is that level of mental strength something that is part of the fabric of the elite athlete?
"Everybody's different, but I definitely think there's an element that this was just my way of reacting to the situation. I do think that elite athletes do have the ability to block out that external 'noise' that other individuals might find more challenging to do.
"It certainly wasn't the case that every day was easy. There were days, weeks, even months during that time when it felt like I was taking four steps backwards, just to get half a step forward; but I think it's a combination of mental toughness that I have as an athlete and as an individual – and I'm way more mentally tough now than I was prior to that. You might think you're tough, but you go through an injury like that and when you finish, you're like wow, you're way tougher than you ever imagined!"
This was just such an intriguing insight into the mental process of working through a serious injury; but that process doesn't end when full fitness is restored – especially in a contact sport like rugby union. When you get back on the field and complete those first tackles, are there any split-second moments of self-doubt?
"I would say that the injury definitely impacted on how I played after – in ways that I wasn't necessarily prepared for. Maybe I was a little bit hesitant in the first couple of minutes of my first game back, but after that it wasn't something that I really thought about.
"It was mainly my confidence on the field, excluding the knee, just my general confidence. At the point when I got back to the national team, I had been 18 months since my previous caps, so for me I felt a bit like I didn't belong here, and I wasn't good enough to be on the pitch, regardless of what happened to my knee.
"And this was where it was really helpful to have that mental support, to be able to work through that confidence gap that I was experiencing, and to try and reframe the challenges and the battles I was having in my head, so that I could play the way that I had played prior to the injury… in fact better than before my injury.
"So now I'm at a point where I don't think about my knee at all. There are definitely circumstances where I'll maybe get hit in an awkward way and that can set me off a little bit; but it's never anything that lingers more than a few seconds. From a complete, overall perspective, I'm now a much more confident player after what I've been through … in fact I'm actually grateful that I went through the process. It wasn't easy, but I'm a better player because of it."
One of the reasons I started this series of interviews was to try and dig under the surface to understand a little about what it takes to be an elite athlete and I've been fascinated not only by the levels of physical and mental strength possessed by everyone I've spoken with; but also the depth and detail they're prepared to share with someone who they don't know.
As a spectator, all you see is the end product of years of training; it's almost impossible to appreciate the dedication and determination required to translate basic talent into elite performance, but equally, as McKinley has so eloquently and openly explained, those times when the most testing challenges are faced and overcome away from the glare of the media - and sometimes essentially alone…
Since her return to competitive rugby, McKinley has been able to return to the national squad and win two further caps during the 2019 Can-Am series. How then did she link up with Exeter Chiefs?
"It basically stemmed from coming to the realisation in the spring [2019] that there may not be university rugby – I still have a year of eligibility left for university sport as a result of my knee. I was always planning to use that, and I definitely wanted to play from that November through to spring because at that point the World Cup was still due to go ahead this fall.
"Our national team coach was talking to some teams over here and I just casually mentioned to him that I was interested in coming over to play, and he put my name forward to Susie [Appleby, Exeter head coach] and Amy [Garnett, assistant coach]; and we went from there.
My next question concerned whether or not there had been conversations with Olivia DeMerchant and Emily Tuttosi, the other two Canadians in the Chiefs squad - except there are three other Canadians, with Taylor Black making up the quartet.
I now need to extend my sincere apologies to Taylor, wish her well with her own recovery from injury, and withdraw my earlier comment that involved the words 'research' and 'professionalism', as I clearly hadn't done the former properly, and it's very much a nail in the coffin for the latter…
"I was talking with Liv and Em quite early on in the process," McKinley admitted. "I knew Em was planning to move from her previous team, Loughborough Lightning, and that Liv was wanting to come over; so we definitely had some interaction and chatting behind the scenes, but obviously had our own conversations with the club.
"Taylor and I actually go to university together, but I had already signed for Exeter before she started the process – by that point we knew that the university season wasn't happening, so that's when she decided to jump on the bandwagon."
And what a bandwagon it has turned out to be!
Unsurprisingly, it took a few games for the squad to find its feet in such a competitive division, but the speed and scale of progress has been remarkable. How did McKinley reflect on the squad's development?
"It was quite difficult. I had only been in the country for a month before the first game, and had only had six practices because of the quarantine. Some of my team mates had even less, so definitely when we played that first game, it was a case of just getting through it, putting the best product as we could on the field, and knowing that we'd continue to grow from week to week.
"I think the great thing about this team from the very beginning was that even though we didn't know each other very well, there was a connection and a friendship that was starting to build. You could see that we were trying to click in the first four or five games, and then finally by the time we played Sale back in December, you could really see that we'd connected well on and off the field and that's what's sustained us through the second half of the season."
Was there a specific game, or even moment when there was a surge of confidence, a noticeable step up from potential to delivering performances capable of beating the best sides in the competition?
"Yeah, and it was weird because I think we all knew we were a good side, and capable to achieving a lot together – even back in October. We were definitely aware of the ability within the squad and the potential we had; it was just a case of making that connection and showing it out on the pitch.
"I would say that moment probably started in the Sale game; it was the first time things really started to click for us; but the big confidence boosts came from the Saracens and Harlequins games. Especially in that Saracens game, we just came out of the gates, really put our foot down, and said it doesn't matter that we're new; we're here to stay. You could feel the energy in the team, and that energy has sustained itself through the several wins that we had.
"Even last weekend against Saracens and a tough loss, that energy is still there, as is the belief that we can compete with and beat every team in this league."
Having been able to watch all of the Chiefs' recent games, it is noticeable that a lot of emphasis is placed on a dominant defence – and not just within the front eight either; the tackling from the backs is every bit as physical. Was this always a natural strength of the group, or the result of hours of hard work on the training pitch and in the gym?
"A combination of both. We definitely have a defensively-minded team, which is really important. You can drill defence all the time in training, but if you don't have players who have that defensive mindset, it's difficult to collectively bring that together. So, I think that we're really lucky that through the whole squad we have that edge; we understand what defence is and we love playing defence. You can have the best attacking players in the world, but it's defence that will win you the game.
"So yes, we do put a lot of work into our defensive structure. You've watched most of games, so you'll have seen our structure evolve week in week out since the start of the season and you're now starting to see the result of those connections as well as the fact that as individuals, we are all defensively-minded."
With regards to the pack, the Exeter squad have gained a reputation for their rolling mauls and pick and gos near the opposition line, and their ability to turn attacking possession into points through the power of their forwards. I wondered how much structure was involved in the various phases; was the positioning and bind determined in advance or done intuitively?
At that point I apologised for what may have sounded a stupid question to an international second row…
"There are no such things as stupid questions," came the reply.
Those who've read most of my articles may well disagree!
"Our movement around that pick and go is something we work on in training. Probably the strength of our team is that we're very selfless when it comes to those situations. There are teams where two or three of the players want to be scoring the tries, which can disrupt the flow of the movement; but we don't have that, and I think that really helps us.
"We just funnel in, and we all know what we're doing at any given time. That role may change depending on where you are, or what side the ball's on; but it's definitely a drilled routine. Sometimes there can be a chaotic element to it, but we're able to find a way to bring it back and get things under control."
That element of Exeter's game was superbly demonstrated in the thrilling 31-29 away win against Wasps – a match in which McKinley scored a hat-trick of tries …from a combined distance of about two metres!
The result was all the more remarkable because the home side crossed for four tries in the opening 20 minutes; so how, individually and collectively, did the Exeter players deal with the situation and find the resolve to fight back?
"You never want to go down by that many points and we let the game get out of hand. They scored because we made errors; it wasn't because they were doing something we couldn't handle, we had momentary lapses in following our structure. We needed to take a step back and a breather and understand that there was still plenty of time left to play. When we're on the front foot, four tries isn't that much for us to make up. Yes, it's a lot of points, but I'd back us to achieve that any time we're playing our structure and we have the momentum.
"We almost had to forget about the scoreboard and get back to playing our style of rugby; focussing on our structure, focussing on what we can control, and swing that momentum back in our direction – and you really saw that in the second half.
"We came out and Kate Zackery caught the ball on the far touchline, ran across the field and up to the 22, and in some ways that was the momentum shift. We realised that we were on the front foot and they spent the second half trying to get back on the horse that they'd be on in those first 20 minutes.
"Once we were on the front foot, it was a case of keeping our foot down on that gas pedal, not getting too panicked, or letting emotion get the better of us, and not letting them do anything that could affect the flow of our game."
Gabby Cantorna's late penalty had edged the Chiefs into the lead, but Wasps launched one last attack, and as the ball was spun right, the winger looked certain to score in the corner … but at the crucial moment, the corner flag fluttered in front of the camera and the try line was completely obscured.
The reaction of the Exeter players suggested the ball hadn't been grounded, but a few tense seconds followed as the referee and the tough judge talked through what they'd seen. The referee then confirmed that it was no try, and the game was over. The reaction of the Chiefs players gathered behind the try line was wonderful to see – there were celebrations in a little bungalow just outside Middlesbrough too – but how do you reflect after such a dramatic finish and superb result?
"We have time collectively as a team to reflect, as well as individually. And I think it depends on the person how fast you can process what just happened. I for one am not someone who can process straightaway – obviously I was excited that we'd won, but I couldn't embrace the importance of the moment and everything that had happened in the game probably until the next day.
"Sometimes I find that I have to completely separate myself from a rugby game for a couple of hours afterwards before I can go back and think about it; but that's just how my brain works. Otherwise, I'm just too over-tired to think about it clearly. But yes, there was an immediate sense of relief at the end of that game because we had made things a little bit harder on ourselves than we would have wanted; but in doing that, it was a great advert for the women's game. Back home people were freaking out about what happened; they'd been really excited after the Saracens and Quins games, but there was a distinct increase in the excitement level after Wasps!"
It was just a shame that supporters had missed out on seeing the game from the terraces. In fact, the Chiefs have only been able to play one fixture in front of their new fans at Sandy Park. How was the experience?
"It was amazing. You miss playing in front of a crowd. It's very eerily silent when you're in the stadium. Sometimes the crowd can be huge with those momentum swings that I was mentioning, but just to hear them screaming when you've done something well is awesome. I'm hopeful we might get the chance to do it again and get fans back for a game before the end of the season, but with the Covid situation and restrictions, who knows?"
That uncertainly also extends to the World Cup, which was due to be held in New Zealand later this year, but has now been postponed until 2022; but has McKinley had the time to consider her club future?
"It's definitely been on my mind. Honestly, we're just trying to figure out what's going to happen with Canada and what our international test match schedule is going to look like; and I think that's going to be the main indicator of what I end up doing. I've really enjoyed my time over here and if I am offered a new contract with Exeter, I would love that, but we'll just have to see how things pan out over the next few weeks and months."
Elite sport has brought some much-needed 'normality' to our television screens over the past year; but what the Chiefs squad have achieved in little more than six months is far from 'normal'. They have lit up the Allianz Premier 15s division and I have been so fortunate to have met and spoken to five of the players who have been involved in creating such an outstanding sporting story.
McKinley is an incredibly engaging young woman, and I found it inspiring to hear her talking about her attitudes to the sport in which she excels. She has already accomplished so much in her rugby career, and hopefully there will be more high points to follow at both club and international level.
There may even be a try scored from more than a metre out … but I'm not holding my breath!
© Richard Kirby and McKinley Hunt 2021
Although the Chiefs winning streak recently ended at the hands of Saracens, who produced an excellent second-half performance to overturn a half-time deficit; there can be little doubt about the remarkable progress and impact that Exeter have made in what is their debut season.
That previous conversation had been with front row forwards Olivia DeMerchant and Emily Tuttosi, and for this latest interview we not only stay in the Chiefs' pack, but also head back across the Atlantic as this article features Canadian international second row McKinley Hunt.
During what I like to call "research" (just to set that professional tone…), I discovered that McKinley's grandfather had played rugby union here in the United Kingdom; at what level had he played, and when did he decide to move to Canada?
"So, my Grandpa's from Edinburgh, so his family is Scottish. He moved to Canada after World War II, so I have a lot of family located over here, which is quite funny. He grew up in Scotland, but actually went to Rugby School in the Midlands, and then did an engineering degree at Cambridge, where he played rugby for the University side. He went on to play for the RAF too, but I don't think he played much representative rugby … maybe some age-grade stuff in Scotland; but the highest level he played was for the RAF.
"I'm not sure what the reason for moving was on my Dad's side; my grandfather had fought in the RAF and I think he was just looking for a new opportunity, and there were so many engineering jobs available in North America around that time; but on my Mom's side, her parents came over because the opportunities just weren't there in Edinburgh at that time."
Given that both sides of McKinley's family both hailed from the Scottish capital and had travelled across the Atlantic to start a new life, had they maybe known each other before emigrating?
"No, so my Grandpa met my Grandma when they moved to Canada. Although her family is Scottish as well, they moved one generation earlier. They didn't even meet where my family is actually from; they met on the west coast of Canada, we currently live much further east, so it was kind of a fluke really!"
A lovely 'fluke' nonetheless. I have always been fascinated by family history and those chance encounters that bring people together and completely change the course of people's lives. I like my geography too, so asked McKinley about her home town, which is King City in Ontario.
"It's actually a very small town, north of Toronto. It's technically in what they call the GTA – the Greater Toronto Area – but it's just a small rural town, lots of farm fields. It's growing in popularity, but it's just a tiny place in a region that's close to lots of bigger towns and cities. I'm only an hour-and-a-half's drive from Toronto, so you can access everything in the city, but…" and McKinley smiled wistfully at this point, "you can also go out for a walk at night and not see anybody, which can be nice!"
It was against that backdrop that McKinley started playing rugby at the age of 14; and three years later she was selected for the Canadian under-20 squad – a massively impressive achievement in anyone's eyes. Given that Canada is such a vast country, how are the best players spotted and given the best chance to reach their potential?
"I think it depends on where you live. We are very good at the sport; we are third in the world and have some really great players, but I wouldn't say that it's one of our sports in terms of popularity. Obviously [ice] hockey would be way up there and even soccer would be up there too; so, a lot of the time it depends on where you live and the teams that you play on.
"For me I was lucky," she continued. "I live in Ontario; it's a much larger province with much more opportunity for rugby as opposed to other provinces. It basically comes down to if you start playing in high school - which is when most people would start – and you enjoy it; then you might go on to play for a club, then maybe university or a provincial representative team. That's usually where you start to get the exposure and be noticed by some of those age-grade coaches.
"It's a lot different now to when I was 15-years old, aspiring to play for Canada, but not really being aware of the pathway. For the youngsters who are starting out now, it's a much clearer route to the top, and the opportunities to build that skill base and show coaches what you can do are now much more accessible than they ever have been."
So was McKinley still at high school (notice how easily I slipped into fluent Canadian) or university when she was chosen for the national under-20 squad.
"It was after my first year at Queen's University [in Kingston, Ontario] when I played for the under-20s, but I was still only 18 when that happened
So presumably the potential for exposure and being noticed is greater once you are in that university environment?
"Exactly. I think it was definitely a combination of being at university but also having played a couple of years of provincial-level rugby by that time. Even during my first year playing for Ontario under-18s, I would occasionally hear that someone might be coming to watch me play, so it was that in conjunction with the university, because coaches will come and watch the national and provincial championships for university sport – they were the two major factors."
McKinley's progress on the field was rewarded with selection to the full international side for the three-test tour to England in 2017 and a senior debut…
"Yes, it was our November series in 2017; we came over here, played England three times, and lost quite badly on all three occasions, but definitely memorable because it was my first time with the full team."
Exeter team mate Olivia DeMerchant was already a fixture in the Canadian squad, and there was also recognition for another club colleague, Emily Tuttosi.
"On that first tour Emily and I were both uncapped – actually, Em might have been capped, I'm not entirely sure – but we were both there on that tour, and Liv [Olivia DeMerchant] was obviously there as well. I spent quite a lot of time with Emily at that point because I had played national under-20s with her in my first year, but I didn't have that much interaction with Olivia … honestly, I was in awe of her," McKinley laughed at the memory, "I was like 'I'm just going to hide in the corner and make sure no one notices me for the wrong reasons!'"
How much time did McKinley get on the field?
"I got game time in all three matches. I think I had about 25 minutes for my first cap and maybe 35 minutes in the second and third; but I came off the bench in all three, which I think was good for my first caps. Looking back, I was definitely not in the mental space to handle the pressure of starting, especially at that point in my career. I was happy to come off the bench!"
Sport can have a nasty habit of placing obstacles in the way, especially when things seem to be going really well; and it wasn't long after those first caps that McKinley sustained a serious ACL [anterior cruciate ligament] injury.
"I had just turned 20 and it was definitely a huge mindset shift," McKinley readily admitted, "something that I wasn't prepared for or expecting, and as you said, it was so tough to come off those first three caps and put in so much work in the off-season to prepare myself for the upcoming season, to then get injured in our first national team camp of 2018.
"Realising that you're going to have to re-evaluate everything you had planned for at least the next 12 months is a hard pill to swallow, but I've come out the other end and I think I'm better for it."
So much emphasis is placed on the psychological aspects of elite sport, being able to produce your best under extreme pressure; but mental toughness can be tested every bit as much, if not more, by the impact of a long-term injury. Was there any support available to McKinley as she went through the process of recovery and rehabilitation?
"I did get some mental support, but nothing formal until just last fall; so, I basically did the whole rehab without any formal assistance. In hindsight it could have helped me get back a bit sooner; but I'm also one of those people who likes to internalise things and not necessarily express them. So, when I got the injury, seeking out assistance was never on my radar – I was just going to put my blinders on, get into the routine of rehab, and try and get to the end of the tunnel."
Is that level of mental strength something that is part of the fabric of the elite athlete?
"Everybody's different, but I definitely think there's an element that this was just my way of reacting to the situation. I do think that elite athletes do have the ability to block out that external 'noise' that other individuals might find more challenging to do.
"It certainly wasn't the case that every day was easy. There were days, weeks, even months during that time when it felt like I was taking four steps backwards, just to get half a step forward; but I think it's a combination of mental toughness that I have as an athlete and as an individual – and I'm way more mentally tough now than I was prior to that. You might think you're tough, but you go through an injury like that and when you finish, you're like wow, you're way tougher than you ever imagined!"
This was just such an intriguing insight into the mental process of working through a serious injury; but that process doesn't end when full fitness is restored – especially in a contact sport like rugby union. When you get back on the field and complete those first tackles, are there any split-second moments of self-doubt?
"I would say that the injury definitely impacted on how I played after – in ways that I wasn't necessarily prepared for. Maybe I was a little bit hesitant in the first couple of minutes of my first game back, but after that it wasn't something that I really thought about.
"It was mainly my confidence on the field, excluding the knee, just my general confidence. At the point when I got back to the national team, I had been 18 months since my previous caps, so for me I felt a bit like I didn't belong here, and I wasn't good enough to be on the pitch, regardless of what happened to my knee.
"And this was where it was really helpful to have that mental support, to be able to work through that confidence gap that I was experiencing, and to try and reframe the challenges and the battles I was having in my head, so that I could play the way that I had played prior to the injury… in fact better than before my injury.
"So now I'm at a point where I don't think about my knee at all. There are definitely circumstances where I'll maybe get hit in an awkward way and that can set me off a little bit; but it's never anything that lingers more than a few seconds. From a complete, overall perspective, I'm now a much more confident player after what I've been through … in fact I'm actually grateful that I went through the process. It wasn't easy, but I'm a better player because of it."
One of the reasons I started this series of interviews was to try and dig under the surface to understand a little about what it takes to be an elite athlete and I've been fascinated not only by the levels of physical and mental strength possessed by everyone I've spoken with; but also the depth and detail they're prepared to share with someone who they don't know.
As a spectator, all you see is the end product of years of training; it's almost impossible to appreciate the dedication and determination required to translate basic talent into elite performance, but equally, as McKinley has so eloquently and openly explained, those times when the most testing challenges are faced and overcome away from the glare of the media - and sometimes essentially alone…
Since her return to competitive rugby, McKinley has been able to return to the national squad and win two further caps during the 2019 Can-Am series. How then did she link up with Exeter Chiefs?
"It basically stemmed from coming to the realisation in the spring [2019] that there may not be university rugby – I still have a year of eligibility left for university sport as a result of my knee. I was always planning to use that, and I definitely wanted to play from that November through to spring because at that point the World Cup was still due to go ahead this fall.
"Our national team coach was talking to some teams over here and I just casually mentioned to him that I was interested in coming over to play, and he put my name forward to Susie [Appleby, Exeter head coach] and Amy [Garnett, assistant coach]; and we went from there.
My next question concerned whether or not there had been conversations with Olivia DeMerchant and Emily Tuttosi, the other two Canadians in the Chiefs squad - except there are three other Canadians, with Taylor Black making up the quartet.
I now need to extend my sincere apologies to Taylor, wish her well with her own recovery from injury, and withdraw my earlier comment that involved the words 'research' and 'professionalism', as I clearly hadn't done the former properly, and it's very much a nail in the coffin for the latter…
"I was talking with Liv and Em quite early on in the process," McKinley admitted. "I knew Em was planning to move from her previous team, Loughborough Lightning, and that Liv was wanting to come over; so we definitely had some interaction and chatting behind the scenes, but obviously had our own conversations with the club.
"Taylor and I actually go to university together, but I had already signed for Exeter before she started the process – by that point we knew that the university season wasn't happening, so that's when she decided to jump on the bandwagon."
And what a bandwagon it has turned out to be!
Unsurprisingly, it took a few games for the squad to find its feet in such a competitive division, but the speed and scale of progress has been remarkable. How did McKinley reflect on the squad's development?
"It was quite difficult. I had only been in the country for a month before the first game, and had only had six practices because of the quarantine. Some of my team mates had even less, so definitely when we played that first game, it was a case of just getting through it, putting the best product as we could on the field, and knowing that we'd continue to grow from week to week.
"I think the great thing about this team from the very beginning was that even though we didn't know each other very well, there was a connection and a friendship that was starting to build. You could see that we were trying to click in the first four or five games, and then finally by the time we played Sale back in December, you could really see that we'd connected well on and off the field and that's what's sustained us through the second half of the season."
Was there a specific game, or even moment when there was a surge of confidence, a noticeable step up from potential to delivering performances capable of beating the best sides in the competition?
"Yeah, and it was weird because I think we all knew we were a good side, and capable to achieving a lot together – even back in October. We were definitely aware of the ability within the squad and the potential we had; it was just a case of making that connection and showing it out on the pitch.
"I would say that moment probably started in the Sale game; it was the first time things really started to click for us; but the big confidence boosts came from the Saracens and Harlequins games. Especially in that Saracens game, we just came out of the gates, really put our foot down, and said it doesn't matter that we're new; we're here to stay. You could feel the energy in the team, and that energy has sustained itself through the several wins that we had.
"Even last weekend against Saracens and a tough loss, that energy is still there, as is the belief that we can compete with and beat every team in this league."
Having been able to watch all of the Chiefs' recent games, it is noticeable that a lot of emphasis is placed on a dominant defence – and not just within the front eight either; the tackling from the backs is every bit as physical. Was this always a natural strength of the group, or the result of hours of hard work on the training pitch and in the gym?
"A combination of both. We definitely have a defensively-minded team, which is really important. You can drill defence all the time in training, but if you don't have players who have that defensive mindset, it's difficult to collectively bring that together. So, I think that we're really lucky that through the whole squad we have that edge; we understand what defence is and we love playing defence. You can have the best attacking players in the world, but it's defence that will win you the game.
"So yes, we do put a lot of work into our defensive structure. You've watched most of games, so you'll have seen our structure evolve week in week out since the start of the season and you're now starting to see the result of those connections as well as the fact that as individuals, we are all defensively-minded."
With regards to the pack, the Exeter squad have gained a reputation for their rolling mauls and pick and gos near the opposition line, and their ability to turn attacking possession into points through the power of their forwards. I wondered how much structure was involved in the various phases; was the positioning and bind determined in advance or done intuitively?
At that point I apologised for what may have sounded a stupid question to an international second row…
"There are no such things as stupid questions," came the reply.
Those who've read most of my articles may well disagree!
"Our movement around that pick and go is something we work on in training. Probably the strength of our team is that we're very selfless when it comes to those situations. There are teams where two or three of the players want to be scoring the tries, which can disrupt the flow of the movement; but we don't have that, and I think that really helps us.
"We just funnel in, and we all know what we're doing at any given time. That role may change depending on where you are, or what side the ball's on; but it's definitely a drilled routine. Sometimes there can be a chaotic element to it, but we're able to find a way to bring it back and get things under control."
That element of Exeter's game was superbly demonstrated in the thrilling 31-29 away win against Wasps – a match in which McKinley scored a hat-trick of tries …from a combined distance of about two metres!
The result was all the more remarkable because the home side crossed for four tries in the opening 20 minutes; so how, individually and collectively, did the Exeter players deal with the situation and find the resolve to fight back?
"You never want to go down by that many points and we let the game get out of hand. They scored because we made errors; it wasn't because they were doing something we couldn't handle, we had momentary lapses in following our structure. We needed to take a step back and a breather and understand that there was still plenty of time left to play. When we're on the front foot, four tries isn't that much for us to make up. Yes, it's a lot of points, but I'd back us to achieve that any time we're playing our structure and we have the momentum.
"We almost had to forget about the scoreboard and get back to playing our style of rugby; focussing on our structure, focussing on what we can control, and swing that momentum back in our direction – and you really saw that in the second half.
"We came out and Kate Zackery caught the ball on the far touchline, ran across the field and up to the 22, and in some ways that was the momentum shift. We realised that we were on the front foot and they spent the second half trying to get back on the horse that they'd be on in those first 20 minutes.
"Once we were on the front foot, it was a case of keeping our foot down on that gas pedal, not getting too panicked, or letting emotion get the better of us, and not letting them do anything that could affect the flow of our game."
Gabby Cantorna's late penalty had edged the Chiefs into the lead, but Wasps launched one last attack, and as the ball was spun right, the winger looked certain to score in the corner … but at the crucial moment, the corner flag fluttered in front of the camera and the try line was completely obscured.
The reaction of the Exeter players suggested the ball hadn't been grounded, but a few tense seconds followed as the referee and the tough judge talked through what they'd seen. The referee then confirmed that it was no try, and the game was over. The reaction of the Chiefs players gathered behind the try line was wonderful to see – there were celebrations in a little bungalow just outside Middlesbrough too – but how do you reflect after such a dramatic finish and superb result?
"We have time collectively as a team to reflect, as well as individually. And I think it depends on the person how fast you can process what just happened. I for one am not someone who can process straightaway – obviously I was excited that we'd won, but I couldn't embrace the importance of the moment and everything that had happened in the game probably until the next day.
"Sometimes I find that I have to completely separate myself from a rugby game for a couple of hours afterwards before I can go back and think about it; but that's just how my brain works. Otherwise, I'm just too over-tired to think about it clearly. But yes, there was an immediate sense of relief at the end of that game because we had made things a little bit harder on ourselves than we would have wanted; but in doing that, it was a great advert for the women's game. Back home people were freaking out about what happened; they'd been really excited after the Saracens and Quins games, but there was a distinct increase in the excitement level after Wasps!"
It was just a shame that supporters had missed out on seeing the game from the terraces. In fact, the Chiefs have only been able to play one fixture in front of their new fans at Sandy Park. How was the experience?
"It was amazing. You miss playing in front of a crowd. It's very eerily silent when you're in the stadium. Sometimes the crowd can be huge with those momentum swings that I was mentioning, but just to hear them screaming when you've done something well is awesome. I'm hopeful we might get the chance to do it again and get fans back for a game before the end of the season, but with the Covid situation and restrictions, who knows?"
That uncertainly also extends to the World Cup, which was due to be held in New Zealand later this year, but has now been postponed until 2022; but has McKinley had the time to consider her club future?
"It's definitely been on my mind. Honestly, we're just trying to figure out what's going to happen with Canada and what our international test match schedule is going to look like; and I think that's going to be the main indicator of what I end up doing. I've really enjoyed my time over here and if I am offered a new contract with Exeter, I would love that, but we'll just have to see how things pan out over the next few weeks and months."
Elite sport has brought some much-needed 'normality' to our television screens over the past year; but what the Chiefs squad have achieved in little more than six months is far from 'normal'. They have lit up the Allianz Premier 15s division and I have been so fortunate to have met and spoken to five of the players who have been involved in creating such an outstanding sporting story.
McKinley is an incredibly engaging young woman, and I found it inspiring to hear her talking about her attitudes to the sport in which she excels. She has already accomplished so much in her rugby career, and hopefully there will be more high points to follow at both club and international level.
There may even be a try scored from more than a metre out … but I'm not holding my breath!
© Richard Kirby and McKinley Hunt 2021